Why am I not surprised

[Sid]

Lost for words really, just seems to be another thing to shrug shoulders, sigh and walk away from....bunch of tw@ts

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1177570/Statue-Battle-Britain-hero-deemed-traditional-Trafalgar-Square-plinth.html

If anyone deserves a permanent memorial, this hero does

[Zooly]

I posted a reply!

[JensenPark]

would be no different in Canada.

Unless the head of fighter defenses was a transgendered, native, mulatto from Quebec.

[Jabo]

A bloody disgrace. Perhaps Westminster City Council would prefer a statue of Goering to occupy that plinth instead. How soon we forget...

~S~ Jabo

[mctav]

This:-

"I'd much rather see modern art then ANOTHER statue of some war hero. There are too many of these around.

- Harry, London, 05/5/2009 17:05"

Its that kind of comment that really makes me want five minutes with a bat in a dark alley with some people.

[Jabo]

Yeah, he got a -1 from me.

[Jediteo]

People like these confirm my slight misanthropy. Some people have no respect what so ever, be it their country or their history. PC bullcrap has to stop.

As Satre wrote, Hell is other people.

[Rico]

It seems like people these days just want to ignore history because they don't find it relevant.

[Jabo]

A story from the Daily Telegraph to illustrate Rico's point;

"Auschwitz is a beer, schoolchildren tell researchers

Some schoolchildren believe Auschwitz is the name of a type of beer or a religious festival, rather than the notorious concentration camp, research has shown.

Around 1.3 million people perished in the Nazi death camp during the Second World War, but a survey of more than 1,000 secondary school pupils aged 11-16 revealed that a quarter still did not know its purpose.

Of those, about 10 per cent were not sure what it was, 8 per cent thought it was a country bordering Germany, 2 per cent thought it was a beer, the same proportion said it was a religious festival and a further 1 per cent said it was a type of bread.

Miramax and the London Jewish Cultural Centre, which commissioned the survey to mark the DVD release of The Boy In The Striped Pyjamas, said that, as there are around 4.5 million 11 to 16-year-olds in the UK, this is the equivalent of 90,000 youngsters wrongly identifying Auschwitz as a drink and 45,000 mistaking it for bread.

The poll found that six in 10 youngsters did not know what the Final Solution was, with a fifth claiming it was the name of peace talks held to end the war.

And it revealed that, despite the Holocaust being specified on the secondary National Curriculum as a subject that pupils must be taught, only just over a third (37 per cent) knew that the Holocaust claimed the lives of six million Jews, with many drastically under-estimating the death toll.

While 97 per cent of those questioned could identify Adolf Hitler from a photograph, those who could not mistook famous figures such as Winston Churchill, Salvador Dali and Albert Einstein for the dictator."

Not all of these are 'children', some are next year's sixth formers and under-graduates in two years time - Education has a lot to answer for.

~S~ Jabo

[DoubleTap]

Decadence is one word for it:

1

[Rattler]

Not all of these are 'children', some are next year's sixth formers and under-graduates in two years time - Education has a lot to answer for.

~S~ Jabo

Just doing my part. I just showed 2 films in Social Studies class - Shake Hands With The Devil (Gen. Romeo Dallaire's experience in Rwanda, 1994), and Schindler's List.

We spent a few weeks with WW1, 2, and the interwar years.

Also, I invited my brother to come to the school for the day to share his experiences in Afghanistan. One of our English classes is studying The Kite Runner, and Derek has read it and can give his insight into the novel. He'll also talk to my gr. 11 Social class, and a couple of other classes.

[Streak]

Good on ya Rattler.

[Tribunus]

“Westminster City Council rejected a figure of the late Air Chief Marshal as too traditional.

[Enforcer57]

Ditto, but I won't say much else or I'll fill two pages. We have these goober heads in the US big time, and I've been pissed off since Seeing Jane Fonda and Ramsey Clark commit treason with impunity when I was in high school .

We need another WW2 type brush with destruction to restore our national character in most western countries, especially US and Britain.

These morons would have us all abolish our armed forces and surrender to

[Painless]

Lost for words really, just seems to be another thing to shrug shoulders, sigh and walk away from....bunch of tw@ts

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1177570/Statue-Battle-Britain-hero-deemed-traditional-Trafalgar-Square-plinth.html

If anyone deserves a permanent memorial, this hero does

~S~ Chaps,

I'll tell you where they should put the bloody statue.....along side one of Sir Hugh Dowding in every capital city of formerly occupied Europe, including Berlin !!! After all the German people owe an awful lot to us all for getting rid of the hard line Nazi bastards who would have had them all die rather that admit defeat.

~S~ Painless

[DoubleTap]

"When our enemies set off nukes in western countries (they will eventually), maybe the populations will be motivated to end their tolerance of such crap..."

My gut says this or something like it is inevitable, which is another reason why I am so pessimistic nowadays.

[DD_Brando]

I can't believe I'm reading some of this stuff

We need another WW2 type brush with destruction to restore our national character in most western countries, especially US and Britain.

WTF??? This is pretty much what Hitler was preaching after WW1, restoring German pride and national character, and look where that got us!

It's not that I don't think Dowding and Park don't deserve to be commemorated - but I also don't think that their memory should be used as a platform to spout nationalistic bullshit from.

The world has turned and maybe it's time to sling a few of those old Victorian generals off their plinths and replace them with a new crop of heroes. I vote for tossing Nelson, well-known admiral and adulterer, off his column and sticking some other git up there.

B

[mctav]

I can't believe I'm reading some of this stuff

. I vote for tossing Nelson, well-known admiral and adulterer, off his column and sticking some other git up there.

B

I cant believe I'm reading that.

[DoubleTap]

I can't believe I'm reading some of this stuff

We need another WW2 type brush with destruction to restore our national character in most western countries, especially US and Britain.

WTF??? This is pretty much what Hitler was preaching after WW1, restoring German pride and national character, and look where that got us!

Actually, I think Hitler was preaching about the national disaster that had already befallen Germany, and used that disaster to propagate his own ideas and agenda.

[Jediteo]

I do not think  another major war is the key. I am a firm believer in that education is the silver bullet towards many of societies problems. Not only education in terms of primary and secondary school, but good parenting is necessary to stimulate learning. If the parents do not care about educating their children of things beyond the very small curriculum schools offer, people are doomed to their own ignorance.

[mctav]

Many good points raised through out the thread. Taking Sids title for the thread and Jediteo's last post regarding the issue of education I guess sums it up.

When you grow up in a culture that frowns on the flying of your own national flag, as it may offend others, and government ministers and councils have stated that the Red Arrows should not be used at opening ceremonies as they are too 'militaristic' is there - as Sid said - any surprise left at these people's attitude.

[DD_Brando]

Godwin's Law doesn't come into it. I'm not calling Enforcer or anyone else a Nazi, or calling Nelson an adulterous git without having my tongue firmly thrust into my cheek - and I'm sorry if anyone doesn't understand a Londoner's humour - but I'm reminding anyone who suggests that we all need a "brush with destruction to restore our national character" that this attitude is fundamentally wrong. War has a nasty habit of killing all the wrong people along with those who maybe deserve to die and it should really be seen as humanity's last resort.

[mctav]

Tongue was well in cheek for the Heat mag comment mate.

[Sid]

Many good points raised through out the thread. Taking Sids title for the thread and Jediteo's last post regarding the issue of education I guess sums it up.

Thanks mctav, in my view your quote also sums it up for me.

I am impressed, and grateful, that a couple of days ago when a rant couldn't be mustered due to the fact I'd already shrugged my shoulders in resignation to the views and attitudes of Westminster, the interpretation of my feelings was understood and confirmed in writing by all contributors both eloquently and forcefully.

I am proud of my personal history and heritage, also my countries, and am extremely grateful to those of these islands and other nations that fought and are fighting still to preserve it. This heritage is inextricably linked with the fates of these other nations and I feel a bond that has been confirmed on this thread.

I am particularly annoyed about the subject of this thread because it is very close to my heart. There is much debate and opinion over the Battle of Britain but what is fact is that it was a very significant period of history for these islands, especially for the South - East and the capital. I have been here http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/mus/uk/1-b/b_of_b_memorial.htm many times, I try to go every time I'm down that way, and each time I am moved by the serenity of the site but am also humbled by the magnitude of the effort of The Few. Looking across to France and up into the sky you can imagine the battle going on, the contrails snaking around the blue as the RAF attempted to stop the Luftwaffe coming across the Channel. The museum and memorial is very appropriate.

It would have been a similar view over London. This memorial http://www.bbm.org.uk/ is within the city so let's not say that there has been nothing done to commemorate AND it is in Westmimster. However, it took a massive effort to get it built from public funds, which, by the way are also being used to keep it clean. Perhaps Westminster Council feel that this one permanent memorial is adequate?

This is my point, that the interested and passionate public have to lobby and cajole to get anything meaningful and significant done at this present time. We should not have to be doing it to the extent that we do and this is one of many issues that add to my frustration with those in elected positions of responsibility that should be acknowledging these national heros on our behalf. There is nothing complicated in doing this, although it is plainly difficult due to the current thinking of those that obviously don't think outside of their compulsory box of modern ideas.

~S~ Sid 

[GreyKnight]

Well put Sid,

I would just like to add that even though London and the SE bore the brunt of the Blitz, the Luftwaffe also bombed as far afield as Liverpool and even Belfast. With the area around Liverpool being the most heavily bombed outside of London.

But anyway... back to shaking our fists at the corrupt politicians and pain-in-the-ass politically correct brigade.