For Brits Only; Input Solution!?

[DD_Arthur]

I'm happy with my MSFFB 2 and I'm skint too but this must be worth watching. Only two days to go;

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/150729566614?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2648

[PropNut]

Well, if I were a Brit, I would give an opinion...but since the thread title precludes me from really engaging in discussion I will not. Although I do own this controller and I would say, if I could, that it is GREAT and would indeed be worth getting if possible. But I cannot give an opinion.

[DD_Arthur]

Well, if I were a Brit, I would give an opinion...but since the thread title precludes me from really engaging in discussion I will not. Although I do own this controller and I would say, if I could, that it is GREAT and would indeed be worth getting if possible. But I cannot give an opinion.

Sorry PropNut, lol. I'm sure an owner opinion would be very interesting and valuable. In my clumsy way I was trying to point out this guy will post to UK only.

[PropNut]

I understood that, I thought I would jump on a good straight line though

[Snacko]

I'd be suprised if it goes for close to that. But I would definitly put in a bid. It retails for $500 here in the USA.

[DD_Brando]

It's already past £70 and seems to have a minimum bar. That is, every time I bid over the price shown it immediately tells me I've been outbid. Some clever automation there, maybe some bright spark can explain that?

[Madfish]

Great controller - one issue though: it has a ton of "flick" switches (on - on, on - off, on - off - on) but barely any "trigger/button" switches. This is a bit lousy for most simming activities unless you go full real in e.g. a DCS A-10 or similar as most commands are actually bound to regular key presses and on-off etc. states are rarely recognized.

That said it's good hardware and very precise.

[PropNut]

I would argue against that Madfish, it is wonderful to toggle on and off the engine, gear, etc. The programing for the controller allows you to make macros and assign any keys or combination of keys to any of the toggles you want. And there are many many momentary (trigger type) buttons on both units as well as several momentary toggle switches.

[Madfish]

True to some point however the problem is that whenever you do that and e.g. crash you need to manually reset all switches because they're not magnetic latching. So while it can be "abused" like this I'm not the biggest fan of it. It's a replica after all - realistic but unergonomic to some degree in many sim titles (stiff switches, specific layout, made to be used with gloves on etc).

Sadly CH isn't pushing out anything new so there's barely any multi-purpose HOTAS alternatives of quality, aside from the force sensing Saitek that is. A HOTAS modeled after the PAK-FA stick would be something but I doubt we'll see that anytime soon.

[PropNut]

"Abused"? lol I get the feeling that you are not happy with anything unless it has the CH logo on it.

Well, I think it is a good controller, over priced true, but a good controller. Believe it or not, most flight sim people want more realism in their games and controller, not less. CH makes a damn fine product, so does Saitek and Thrustmaster.

[Madfish]

Haha, no offense but you couldn't be more wrong.

Yes, I do have an CH fighterstick, a rudder and 2 yoke. But I'm not using them anymore. In fact, and that's why I said that I don't see much sense in buying CH products as they are seriously behind their competitors these days (until they release something new maybe).

I also have an old Saitek X36 and X45 as well as a Thrustmaster Cougar and racing wheel and I recommended the T16000 or X52s for people that wanted more precision (hall sensors) but for a fair price.

From that I hope you can see that I'm not a CH fanboy at all (and btw: I hate company advertisment logos on MY hardware)

The reason why I said it is exactly because I am NOT a fanboy, which includes Thrustmaster. Thus I felt it's worth mentioning that the Warthog is a great specialized stick but only an average multi-purpose device - aside from it's precision it has serious ergonomic flaws. If you want to fly Freespace with that thing you get tears in your eyes because it's basically impossible without binding half the stuff to the keyboard again. Some target driver software abuse can overcome this a little, yes, but it's still not ergonomica, practical and by far not very time saving.

But as I said - there are sadly almost no alternatives to the warthog right now, in terms of quality, if you're willing to put money down. The logitech hotas has force feedback but is a joke otherwise with all it's firmware issues. The saitek has force sensing so it's not for everyone and the warthog has the traditional stick but is very specialized and made for the rougher grip and hand.

As I plan to do a lot more flying again this year I am looking into this myself and will most likely buy a Warthog too. But I know I will regret it because it's just not a great joystick - it's a great replica stick but there is a difference between the two.

It's precise and has a few switches etc. that you need in some modern jet-age sims (western simulations, the russians are using very different HOTAS layouts) but I don't just play modern sims, in fact I largely try to avoid them due to complexity / time restraints. I play WW sims and sci-fi / action stuff as well. It doesn't have force feedback, it has only 3 flap settings, it could use some more buttons, the ergonomics could be better and not made for wearing gloves (including all switches / hats etc) and I'm not at all happy with the input availability on the throttle grip unit at all as it's bulky but their could be way more controls on it.

That said I'd still recommend watching the auction. It's a decent stick, precise, overpriced and not well engineered but an awesome quality copy of the original. Sadly no alternatives as I said. Only eventually if you like force sensing stuff (which I don't really for some reason).

[B16Enk]

It's already past £70 and seems to have a minimum bar. That is, every time I bid over the price shown it immediately tells me I've been outbid. Some clever automation there, maybe some bright spark can explain that?

Someone has set a maximum bid higher than yours Ross, this will automatically out bid up to the maximum you set.

[Mayhem]

I don't own the Warhog either, but from what I've seen and herd about it, it looks like it's great for modern jet simulation especially DCS-A10C obviously which is what it was made for. I imagine it might be pretty good for Black Shark and Flaming Cliffs 2/3 but the issue really is when something becomes so specialized it is bound to lack in other areas. I love the concept of having a realistic sim pit representation of an actual aircraft however in practicality its definitely not ideal. I find that in practice it is much better to make things that are adaptable or universal especially if you are the type that flies more then once sim let alone plane. What your basically left with is making your own mishmash or controllers both production and custom.

Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome to have a sim pit for several different planes and then maybe a universal one as well but I personally can neither fund that nor have the time/room for it. There are a ton of guys on the internet with replica pits for A-10, Blackshark, F-16, Bf109 and Spitfires just to name a few and I find them simply wonderful. If I could own one of each with the addition of a custom universal pit I'd be like a kid in a candy store however its just not practical. I mean if all I did was fly DCS-A10c exclusively then why not, but the reality is, like with most of us, I fly all kinds of sims, let alone planes.

If I have an extra 500 bucks and nothing else to spend it on I'd get a Warhog, but like I do now, I'd be swapping it out every time I switched sims and there are a few other bits I'd like to get before then like a touch screen for example. As it stands I'm spending too much time with IL-2 and ROF to warrant getting DSC-A10c let along a specialized controller for it. Now when Flaming Cliffs 3 comes out, I will probably be more onboard with the DCS series although even then I don't know if I'll be looking at a Warthog anytime soon. It looks like a well made controller but its a really shame there is not FFB to it. The Logitech looked so promising but I've herd a lot of negative things about it and I'm just not convicted of its performance or usability.

Just my 2 secs, its a very interesting conversations and I love talking about controllers.

[DD_Brando]

It went up to £190 at the end - and that is still a good deal compared to new retail.

I can give one important reason why CH flightgear is so good IMO: it's really moddable! No other manufacturer has better bodywork for cutting and shutting, drilling and filling - and a whole bunch of room for extra cabling and switchgear. But I certainly agree that it's time they added a new model.

[Madfish]

Yes, someone bid e.g. 100€ brit thingy (whoa my keyboard doesn't have that pound icon-.-). If no one would bit he'd get it for the minimum amount currently shown but as you make your bids the amount raises until you bid more then he did.

That said, for auctions that I really want to win but not raise artificially I do this:

- Log in and open the page 2 times and put them next to each other.

- decide on the amount you want to pay at most

- enter that amount on the one page but don't send it yet

- watch the auction on the other page and then 10 seconds before it runs out send your maximum amount

Using this technique you won't end up overpaying and you won't artificially raise the bids before the auction runs out.

[edit] oh wow, seems I was late [/edit]