URGENT - Tank Event - VR / Track IR users - Potential Issue

Friar · October 31, 2020

Salute,

During testing tonight with FT (thank you sir for your assistance) we uncovered something which could be VERY bad for the event if you are using VR or possibly Track IR as well.

We found that any tank (friendly or enemy) which was outside of a 10 o'clock to 2 o'clock cone of vision would disappear from view when for example viewed from the Commanders / Gunners seat (either from inside the turret if you have viewing slots or from being standing up with the hatch open.

The difference between an object appearing and disappearing could be as small as 1 degree of movement. This could mean an enemy tank in a clear firing position will be invisible to you, but he can still kill you.

After urgent trolling through the IL2 forums I found a post that suggested using the "T" command (default for take control of gun/turret) made the objects appear.

We tested this in the Panzer III L and the IV G but do not think it is limited to German tanks.

The forums seem to mention something about image culling (the screen by default only showing what is in your field of view (to improve performance) with the mouse (obviously VR and TrackIR go way beyond this)

When testing using the Panzer III L and taking the gunner position, then opening hatch to be standing above the gun, by default I could control the gun with my joystick, fire and see the ballistics but turning to look to my 4'oclock to look at FT, he was not there.

I hit "T"

The gun rotated back to a central position, I no longer had control but I could see FT now.

If I then dropped down from the hatch to the gun sight view I could control it as normal. When I swang the gun round to 4 o'clock I could see FT's tank as normal.

When in the IV G with the hatch closed there are 4 little windows at 12, 3, 6 and 9 o'clock. FT was directly behind me. I could not see him.

I hit "T"

I could now see him behind me.

I have ended up having to add a new button to send "T" after taking the Commanders seat. So I am effectively sending the default key sequence of Right Shift + 2 (Assume second firing position, Commander) and then hitting another key to send "T". This then enables me look all around in VR and be able to see tanks at any angle.

Hopefully I will not forget to hit this extra key in the heat of battle when changing from seat to seat!

I tried using the key mappings software to send Right Shift+2 + T to my X52 but that did not work. I also tried adding it as a macro but that also did not work.

FT tried to set up his Track IR and believe he found the same issue.

I don't think it will be an issue when in gunsight mode but that is not where you have the best situational awareness.

Regards

Friar.

FoolTrottel · October 31, 2020

(My best experience during this test was when Friar in his Panzer could see me in my T34 and I could see him - us all being at 12 o'clock - and we just confirmed all that stuff over TS ... and then I hit him with a 76mm APHE shell - in the face!)

Can I switch sides please?

In the end, and in short, I think the real thing out of all this: Whilst in VR, driving the tank from either driver or commander position, make sure you have the turret control off.

Just to see stuff that may be hidden.

There is something similar going on with TIR, although not that serious: On externals (f2) I could not use TIR to look around when I was in control of the turret. Pressing T where the gun automatically rotates back to 12 position, I could look around just fine.

In the end, when in VR, do not be surprised when my PIII is being you completely unseen and dinging your paint with its puny gun! Be prepared to be blindly deafened!

Sid · November 1, 2020

I had to read your post a few times Friar...

I use TrackIR.

The tank position views for gunners are similar to manning aircraft gunner positions.

There are 4 keys for aircraft:

1. Man a position.... LCtrlC Swap between crew positions

2. Take control of the guns...T Unlock the gun and use the simplified sighting system

3. Nestle into the gunsight...LShtT Gun is unlocked, get your eye next to the sight for more accurate shots

4. Turret position...LShtC Aircraft like the Ju88 and Pe2 have more than 1 gun available in a crew position, this allows you to jump from 1 gun to another in the same position.

These are basically similar in tank crew positions:

1. Man a position.....LCtrlC In this situation, the gunner position. Default view is either looking through a visor or the sight but with no gun movement

2. Take control of the guns...T The main gun is unlocked and you can move it. You see a basic sight or a sight with the triangles.

3. Nestle into the gunsight...LShtT Panzer 4 and later German tanks available in 'Tank Crew' give you a better sight, earlier tanks don't do anything with this mapping.

In the Panzer 3 and T34s you are the gunner and commander. If you open the hatch by using the 'Open canopy' mapping and go outside you are now in effect away from the main gun but can still fire it if you have taken control of the gun although going outside can cancel gun control....perhaps this is what you are eluding to. If you want to look around ie. come away from the gunsight then you have to let go of control of the gun by pressing T. This should allow you to look around in VR and TrackIR.

I tried it in Quick mission and could see the AI tanks on my side and the enemy. I don't know anything about image culling or the other terms you found, I use the default settings and visualise where I am in the tank, inside, outside, using sight or not. I couldn't recreate what you found. I think that using the default mappings and trying them with individual tanks will get the familiarity needed.

Friar · November 1, 2020

Hi Sid,

It may not be a problem with AI tanks. I will try and check today.

Ref the tanks. In the Panzer IV G you view outside the turret from the commanders position, not the gunner, like in the III. You do not have fire or turret control.

Perhaps tonight I will ask FT to put a dogfight map up with tanks before we go to P38's to quickly check. We both spawn in tanks of the same make and I will put myself behind you, behind the 10 - 2 arch. If you then try to turn your head round (not the tank or turret) to see me we can see what happens.

It may be that TIR is ok after all ands it's just VR.