[rgmw]largie Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Just read onthe UK Airshow review about a crash @ Duxford this afternoon: "Hate mentioning this but P-51 Mustang "Big Beautiful Doll" has crashed at Legends, after a mid-air collision with the French Skyraider. The pilot was seen parachuting out and is ok - this has been announced over the airfield. The Skyraider, missing a large chunk of it's right wing, was able to make a safe landing at Duxford. It happened after the break away at the end of the Balbo. " http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=35085#p352022 ( Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooly Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Oh man, glad no-one was seriously hurt though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2. Administrators Jabo Posted July 10, 2011 2. Administrators Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Just spoken to Blubear who's confirmed that the Skyraider lost about 1 quarter of it's wing but managed to land safely at Duxford. BBD was seen to go down away from the airfield, the pilot (believed to be Rob Davies) was seen to parachute out and has been confirmed OK thanfully. Jabo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonar Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Holy crap.... The Dogz got to see a P-51 go down !! Too bad for the planes but what an airshow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2. Administrators Jabo Posted July 10, 2011 2. Administrators Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Yes m8, Blubear, Fenrir, Pappabear (BB's dad who wants to join us!) FT, Sweper and Painless were there today. Jabo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum Friar Posted July 10, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Zooly just gave me this link http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=35085&start=25 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum DD_Fenrir Posted July 10, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 hmmmm. someone wasn't watching where he was going methinks.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gec Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 too bad for the P-51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum DD_Fenrir Posted July 11, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmsJW0-6JB0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gothkrieger Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Glad to see pilot made it but just, he was not very high when he bailed and it was a good thing he did not delay any longer than he did. It is always very sad when one of these rare planes go down, it's to bad. The B17 and now the P51, it has been a hard year so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum Painless Posted July 11, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 http://www.youtube.c...h?v=ZmsJW0-6JB0 ~S~ Fen, I do believe it has been removed old bean : ( ~S~ P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum DD_Fenrir Posted July 11, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Balls. That was the most clear and consistent video of the lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooly Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Maybe its due to the investigation that is currently taking place, personally I believe it was the Frenchman in the A1 that killed BBD and the pilot deserves to be beaten/flayed for being a complete amateur/git/moron/blind bastard/idiot/erm..struggling for superlatives now but having seen the vid (look on the BBC website (maybe local website) I would conclude that it was completely avoidable ( a bit like the near miss with a Spitfire earlier). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum DD_Fenrir Posted July 11, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 My only concession to the Spad pilot is that it might be that BBD was hidden behind his canopy framing until the last moment and he was looking the wrong way when it appeared. Can happen. Lord knows I've lost enough bandits and friendlies behind the framing even with 6DoF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum Painless Posted July 11, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 ~S~ Chaps, I have seen the more complete video and I have to say that the Frenchie , when it came to his turn to break from the vic ( he was on the left so by the standard method adopted by all of the other vics in the Balbo he broke high and left 2 seconds after the leader ) he banked way to much ! He was at 90deg as opposed to 60deg when banking so he turned inside the leading Mustang (BB Doll) ! The Skyraider should have gently turned left onto downwind a safe distance behind BB Doll but unfortunately converged with it mid air while still turning left to get onto downwind. That said he did a fantastic job to recover and land What do you think ? ~S~ Painless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum B16Enk Posted July 12, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 First vid here shows very clearly the elevator(s) being knocked off: Cambridge Evening News Definitely too hard a bank by the Skyraider.. Allegedly this happened too: Fokker Triplane nosed over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum FoolTrottel Posted July 12, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 The Skyraiders pilot is definately to blame. He did not watch his leader, did not anticipate his moves... Something belonging to the category "hearsay:" Sunday evening, outside our hotel I spoke to two German guys who said the Skyraider pilot had had two instances of near misses that day, one when too close for comfort close in a formation, and one where he started his landing approach while two spits were on the field, having just landed. The SP had to go FT and pull up sharply to avoid crashing into 'm. Repeat: category "hearsay:" Me thinks he went to a party Saturday evening... as he was flying perfectly fine and normal the first day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[rgmw]largie Posted July 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 <SNIP> Allegedly this happened too: Fokker Triplane nosed over I read somwhere that the pilot of the Fokker was caught in the propwash of some aircraft being run up as it was landing. This caused the plane to tip to port causing the port wing tip to hit the ground causing the whole thing to tip over. I wasn't there so can't confirm that that's the case however. Cheers Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[rgmw]largie Posted July 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 <snip> , and one where he started his landing approach while two spits were on the field, having just landed. The SP had to go FT and pull up sharply to avoid crashing into 'm. Repeat: category "hearsay:" <snip> As I understand it the Sky raider was displaying and during a pass across the airfield failed to notice until the last minute that there were two Spitfires landing. He was obliged to pull up sharply at full throttle and subsequently took no further part in that display ;- presumably due to shock. Again, I was not there but it seems to be a common story from a number of witnesses. Cheers Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1. DDz Quorum DD_Fenrir Posted July 12, 2011 1. DDz Quorum Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 Different Skyraider involved in the collsion than the one who dodged the Spits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blairgowrie Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 http://player.vimeo.com/video/26291756? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JensenPark Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 Thanks Jim...best view yet. Now this is pure speculation but: It almost looks like the P51 pilot panicked. Back (bottom) fuselage by the tail wheel was hit but no control surfaces damaged. He jettison's canopy within seconds. P51 is bumped 'off course' but he is still able to correct the course immediately so flight controls work... Plane flies quite nice and straight for a while before he bails out. I'm shocked how low he was before actually jumping. Surprised he lived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_O_A_D Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 I'm thinking the same thing JP??? I bet after seeing the video, he probably thinks the same way. Unless of course he knows for sure he lost control of it and had nothing but ailerons. And the plane just so happened to fly that way all on its own. But I think not since it changed course as soon as he left it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBear Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 Here's my take on things chaps... Fenrir and I grew up with this aircraft practically on our doorstep, and it really was gut-wrenching seeing it all unfold in front of our very eyes. Can I just add at this point that the pilot and former owner of this Mustang is a chap called Rob Davies, who is considered one of the most experienced '51 drivers in the world. He had nearly 15 years of safe flying in that very aircraft, frequently flying to and from work in it (he worked in the aerospace industry) and a regular at airshows across Europe. Now, with that in mind I'm guessing Rob would've needed a pretty big reason to part company with his steed and join the caterpillar club... It is clear in the videos that the Skyraider's wing impacts the rear underside of the Mustang fuselage, just behind the radiator doghouse and if you look at the attatched cutaway drawing you will notice this is exactly where the control cables run for the tail surfaces. My bet is that after impact he very soon realises, when his stick isn't doing what it's supposed to, that the aircraft is irrecoverable and performs the following actions to initiate 'Operation self-preservation!' Firstly, by popping the canopy irregardless, then if you look at some of the close ups it appears there is maybe 15degrees of flap applied, this could be to try and maintain/gain (if possible) some altitute whilst steering a course away from the airfield. Then, without a minute to spare, he climbs out and hits the silk, to our absolute relief. It was a sickening thing to watch, but glad that the outcome was positive with no loss of life. The AAIB will of course release the findings in their investigation in due course, but from what I saw, and have since seen, to me it looks as the though unfortunately the number 2 in the flight has lost sight of his leader and the unthinkable has happened. It is also worth mentioning that Mr Davies is noted to be an authority in correct bail out procedures from a warbird, in particular the P-51. Big B, i'm gonna miss you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JensenPark Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 Bear: was wondering the same thing about control cables...except at how fast he was able to right the plane's course. And it didn't appear (emphasis on the word 'appear') that the fuselage was cut. And of course it is all 'guess work' by us amateurs at this time. Mind boggling that he was able to get out safe at such a low altitude. When I did my P51 flight last week, I was in a chute. The pilot said that if it was anywhere near 1000 feet and we had to get out, he'd simply crash land it as the chute wouldn't open in time. Yet this guy made it. Happy for that. Looked like he was around 500 feet tops. Like one of those goofy BASE jumpers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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